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Second year I Owned The Speed Bump the under hood battery failed and was replaced under warranty. The Honda dealer installed battery is still in the car today. The replacement battery had no "eye"
Hmm... Wonder if they were using crappy batteries. My 'Z has a battery dated July 2017. 3 years isn't a good lifespan for a battery, especially considering that the one in the 'Z hardly gets used since the IMA motor is what starts the car.

I actually wonder if a deep-cycle or a marine deep-cycle battery would work better. This would allow you to leave the headlights and radio on with the engine off without damaging the battery. Might be useful for a few people, at least.
 

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In my case the car was bought late (August?) 2013 and between the time I bought the car and where battery was replaced I had moved from VA to TX. Battery failed when car was on jack stands for a week having wheels refinished. Prior to that failure the car was daily driven. Since I bought the car with 10 miles on it I just presume it did not get enough charge and it sitting just made it fail. I have had no issues since then and all was covered by warranty.

Batteries fail it ls luck of the draw. Mom's1989 Buick Park Avenue Ultra had its OE battery for 26 years but went through alternators fast. My 2000 Pontiac Grand Prix GTP Coupe also went through a lot of alternators and a few batteries in 13 years. Other cars I never replaced an under hood battery. You just have to know the warning signs.

As for the CR-Z I believe part of the known battery issue is that I believe ( but others argue the point) that the under hood battery is intermittently charged and the car prioritizes charging the IMA battery over the under hood battery. Remember we do not have an alternator and the IMA system both charges and discharges the IMA battery.

Hmm... Wonder if they were using crappy batteries. My 'Z has a battery dated July 2017. 3 years isn't a good lifespan for a battery, especially considering that the one in the 'Z hardly gets used since the IMA motor is what starts the car.

I actually wonder if a deep-cycle or a marine deep-cycle battery would work better. This would allow you to leave the headlights and radio on with the engine off without damaging the battery. Might be useful for a few people, at least.
 

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In my case the car was bought late (August?) 2013 and between the time I bought the car and where battery was replaced I had moved from VA to TX. Battery failed when car was on jack stands for a week having wheels refinished. Prior to that failure the car was daily driven. Since I bought the car with 10 miles on it I just presume it did not get enough charge and it sitting just made it fail. I have had no issues since then and all was covered by warranty.
Likely it sat on the dealer lot, then. 1 week is not nearly enough for a battery to fail. I've had cars sit for nearly a month and the battery works just fine. Maybe it sat for a while at the dealer, with people opening and closing the doors all the time but not driving it, leading to the battery becoming discharged, which is an excellent way to kill an SLI battery. Then, 1 week of sitting 2 years later could have been the last straw.

On my 2005 Civic I installed a quad HID setup with 4 55w ballasts, plus 2 30w LED fog lights. with all the lights on, the voltage drops to about 12.0-12.6v (with the engine on) leading to the battery becoming discharged with the car running. A new battery only lasted 2 years, I had to replace it in December of 2019. Thankfully it had a warranty.
Edit: the voltage only dropped at idle. at 1.5k RPMs or higher, the voltage did stay above 13.8v.

As for the CR-Z I believe part of the known battery issue is that I believe ( but others argue the point) that the under hood battery is intermittently charged and the car prioritizes charging the IMA battery over the under hood battery. Remember we do not have an alternator and the IMA system both charges and discharges the IMA battery.
The little testing I've done indicates that the battery is constantly recharged. I'm using Torque Pro and a bluetooth OBD2 scanner. I haven't figured out how to log data yet. I have a 4 hour drive planned this month, so I'll try to figure out the logging and I'll log the voltage for the trip to see if this is true.
 

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3 years isn't a good lifespan for a battery, especially considering that the one in the 'Z hardly gets used since the IMA motor is what starts the car.
This is actually one of the biggest reasons the 12 volt fails and why it's so important to DRIVE the car regularly and not just for short little trips.
 

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Scan Gauge II hard wired into the OBD II port while driving the voltage indicated goes from <11.4 to over 14 I presume when less than 12 battery is not actively being charged. And no this is not when in Autostop. I still believe that the under hood battery is intermittently charged and prioritizes IMA charging over under hood if IMA needs more charging than under hood.

In my case none of us will ever know what killed The Speed Bump's first battery all I know is it died when car was at dealer for over a week not being driven and was replaced and I have not had a similar issue since. It could have been defective or any number of other issues.

I actively drive The Speed Bump for over 20 minutes continuous drive at least once a month but usually about once a week and try to have at least one longer drive a month where the IMA battery charge ends up 7 or greater. With the pandemic and the less frequent use of the car I have seen the IMA bars which used to be usually 6 or above drop as low as 0-1.

Currently for my amusement I have not bought gas for 3 months and will not fill it up till the low fuel light goes on to see what the average MPG for the tank is on The Scan Gauge II, Dash A odometer ( which resets every tank) and the B Odometer which I never reset but which resets every 10K miles or so or when it was reset by dealer without my permission.

Likely it sat on the dealer lot, then. 1 week is not nearly enough for a battery to fail. I've had cars sit for nearly a month and the battery works just fine. Maybe it sat for a while at the dealer, with people opening and closing the doors all the time but not driving it, leading to the battery becoming discharged, which is an excellent way to kill an SLI battery. Then, 1 week of sitting 2 years later could have been the last straw.

On my 2005 Civic I installed a quad HID setup with 4 55w ballasts, plus 2 30w LED fog lights. with all the lights on, the voltage drops to about 12.0-12.6v (with the engine on) leading to the battery becoming discharged with the car running. A new battery only lasted 2 years, I had to replace it in December of 2019. Thankfully it had a warranty.
Edit: the voltage only dropped at idle. at 1.5k RPMs or higher, the voltage did stay above 13.8v.


The little testing I've done indicates that the battery is constantly recharged. I'm using Torque Pro and a bluetooth OBD2 scanner. I haven't figured out how to log data yet. I have a 4 hour drive planned this month, so I'll try to figure out the logging and I'll log the voltage for the trip to see if this is true.
 

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Scan Gauge II hard wired into the OBD II port while driving the voltage indicated goes from <11.4 to over 14 I presume when less than 12 battery is not actively being charged. And no this is not when in Autostop. I still believe that the under hood battery is intermittently charged and prioritizes IMA charging over under hood if IMA needs more charging than under hood.
My Civic does the same thing at more or less random intervals while cruising. Voltage would be fine at about 14.3v, then it would drop to 11.6 or thereabaouts, then go back up to 14v. Has The Speed Bump always done that? Haven't checked too much, but what I'vee seen on my 'Z is a steady voltage between 13.9 and 14.1, never dropping any lower. 11.4v is just straight battery voltage with 0 power being supplied from the DC-DC converter. I'm no expert, by any means, but that doesn't seem right to me. AFAIK, when a car is not charging the battery, it maintains the voltage at about 13.2v. 13.8v is the voltage used to maintain a lead-acid battery.
 

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Yes. The voltage indication on the Scan gauge while driving and charging IMA will drop below 12 not often but sometimes this is why I think it charges the under hood battery intermittently. But I have also a few times seen the voltage over 13 when in auto stop at a light but not often.

Your Civic has an alternator the CR-Z does not so I would expect constant voltage on a Civic not on a CR-Z. Under heavy load ( all lights on and AC on etc) I would expect the Civics output voltage to drop, just like the failing Alternators on my families GM cars would drop even lower just before failure. This is why my Dad had a cheap accessory socket voltage meter for his cars.

There is an acceptable range for output voltage on an alternator. I presume similar on a CR-Z DC to DC converter but as I keep repeating I think the CR-Z does not constantly charge the under hood battery or the IMA and it prioritizes the IMA over under hood and moves the charging to where it is needed most if it is charging.

My Civic does the same thing at more or less random intervals while cruising. Voltage would be fine at about 14.3v, then it would drop to 11.6 or thereabaouts, then go back up to 14v. Has The Speed Bump always done that? Haven't checked too much, but what I'vee seen on my 'Z is a steady voltage between 13.9 and 14.1, never dropping any lower. 11.4v is just straight battery voltage with 0 power being supplied from the DC-DC converter. I'm no expert, by any means, but that doesn't seem right to me. AFAIK, when a car is not charging the battery, it maintains the voltage at about 13.2v. 13.8v is the voltage used to maintain a lead-acid battery.
 

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Yes. The voltage indication on the Scan gauge while driving and charging IMA will drop below 12 not often but sometimes this is why I think it charges the under hood battery intermittently. But I have also a few times seen the voltage over 13 when in auto stop at a light but not often.

Your Civic has an alternator the CR-Z does not so I would expect constant voltage on a Civic not on a CR-Z. Under heavy load ( all lights on and AC on etc) I would expect the Civics output voltage to drop, just like the failing Alternators on my families GM cars would drop even lower just before failure. This is why my Dad had a cheap accessory socket voltage meter for his cars.

There is an acceptable range for output voltage on an alternator. I presume similar on a CR-Z DC to DC converter but as I keep repeating I think the CR-Z does not constantly charge the under hood battery or the IMA and it prioritizes the IMA over under hood and moves the charging to where it is needed most if it is charging.
This is what I found after a (very) short drive. I figured out how to log data in Torque Pro
61592

Grey is speed (in m/s), and the other 2 are voltages. I assume that 'Control Module' voltage is the voltage being received by the ECU, and 'OBD voltage' is the voltage being sent directly to the scanner. Either way, it never drops below 13.8. This was just a short 2 minute drive around the neighborhood at 15mph (the car was already warmed up, though). I'll do another one of these for a longer drive when I get the chance.

Your Civic has an alternator the CR-Z does not so I would expect constant voltage on a Civic not on a CR-Z.
I completely disagree. On a car with an alternator, the alternator speed depends directly on the engine speed. the engine can go anywhere from 800 to 8000 RPMs, so there's a huge variation in the speed of the alternator. This means that the amount of power the alternator can supply varies too. That's why voltage tends to drop slightly when the engine is at idle. Alternators use, as far as I know, an electromagnet (called field windings) to create a magnetic field, which induces a current on the rotating coils attached to the input shaft. By varying the magnetic field created by the field windings, you can keep the voltage more or less steady, regardless of the alternator speed. While it does work, it allows the voltage to vary quite a bit, especially if the engine is at idle.

The CR-Z doesn't have a dedicated alternator, but the IMA motor, in principle, is very similar. The magnetic field is provided by permanent magnets instead of electromagnets, though. AFAIK, the IMA motor is always providing a small amount of electricity to the IMA battery, except then the motor is being used for assist, or when the engine is stopped. Of course, when braking or coasting, the IMA motor provides very large amounts of energy to the battery to recharge it. This small ammount of current is just enough to keep the battery from discharging, especially when you're cruising on the highway. The energy produced by the IMA motor goes into the IMA battery, then to the DC-DC converter before being sent to the 12v battery. Unlike the energy coming out of a traditional alternator, the energy coming out of the IMA motor goes into a buffer, then comes out through a DC-DC converter. This is why I'd expect to see much more stable voltage in the CR-Z.

at 0.6kWh, the hybrid battery is small. If it weren't receiving this constant trickle charge when not being used, it would slowly drain while cruising. Plus, the IMA motor can likely supply several kilowatts worth of power to the IMA battery, while the DC-DC converter can probably draw 450w maximum, likely less. I doubt that an extra 400w of load would prevent the IMA motor from charging the IMA battery.

I'm certainly not an expert, not by any means. I'm just assuming everything I say based on the knowledge I have about batteries, my experience with the car, and what seems logical to me. The Civic taught me how it feels when a car's voltage is low: Wipers are slow, HID lights sometimes extinguish, fans run slower, etc. I've never experienced that with the 'Z. I'd really like to know more about this, so the best thing, I think, would be to either ask an expert who knows for sure what they're talking about, or ask other members to log their voltages and see their results.

BTW, if anyone wants to ckeck the Excel file, let me know.
 

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Super excited to mount these on today for the Z

Advan Sport A/S+ 225/40/18








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I think 225s look excellent on the CR-Z. a bit too much stick-out on the front for my taste, but I love how the wide tires look, especially since the car isn't too big.
 

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Lets agree to disagree. Alternator has a voltage regulator on it where as the DC to DC converter is variable voltage and charging/discharging of IMA battery or that is my understanding. All data I provided on posting is based on observations in my car with my instrumentation.

I have a straight voltage reading from the OBD and it varies as I said. Believe me or don't this is my observations over hours of driving my CR-Z with the gauge permanently mounted in the car under many different conditions.

I think a lot of your assumptions and comparisons between the standard Alternator and the IMA motor generator are Wrong. At this point it is a wonderful discussion but academic and like I said lets agree to disagree. The IMA is much more than a simple belt driven alternator. There may not be any charging of the under hood as I observed under certain conditions as I explained. I believe the CR-Z as I have now said multiple times prioritizes IMA battery charging over under hood battery if it has to adjust and my observations of the voltage seems to agree with this hypothesis. There are times in my car that the meter reads <11.4 volts while driving but does go up to over 13 under some conditions and drops to 12.5 under auto stop. and has dropped to 11.7 if in accessory and listening to radio. I have had the IMA battery charge usually be 6 and up but on some short trips lately it has gone down to 0 when it is charging under those conditions the voltage is lower than when IMA battery is full (7 and above) but it has only gone down to 0 2 times on short errand trips .

We have gone off on so much of a tangent no one cares.

QUOTE="MrFastFox666, post: 1392046, member: 75014"]
This is what I found after a (very) short drive. I figured out how to log data in Torque Pro
View attachment 61592
Grey is speed (in m/s), and the other 2 are voltages. I assume that 'Control Module' voltage is the voltage being received by the ECU, and 'OBD voltage' is the voltage being sent directly to the scanner. Either way, it never drops below 13.8. This was just a short 2 minute drive around the neighborhood at 15mph (the car was already warmed up, though). I'll do another one of these for a longer drive when I get the chance.


I completely disagree. On a car with an alternator, the alternator speed depends directly on the engine speed. the engine can go anywhere from 800 to 8000 RPMs, so there's a huge variation in the speed of the alternator. This means that the amount of power the alternator can supply varies too. That's why voltage tends to drop slightly when the engine is at idle. Alternators use, as far as I know, an electromagnet (called field windings) to create a magnetic field, which induces a current on the rotating coils attached to the input shaft. By varying the magnetic field created by the field windings, you can keep the voltage more or less steady, regardless of the alternator speed. While it does work, it allows the voltage to vary quite a bit, especially if the engine is at idle.

The CR-Z doesn't have a dedicated alternator, but the IMA motor, in principle, is very similar. The magnetic field is provided by permanent magnets instead of electromagnets, though. AFAIK, the IMA motor is always providing a small amount of electricity to the IMA battery, except then the motor is being used for assist, or when the engine is stopped. Of course, when braking or coasting, the IMA motor provides very large amounts of energy to the battery to recharge it. This small ammount of current is just enough to keep the battery from discharging, especially when you're cruising on the highway. The energy produced by the IMA motor goes into the IMA battery, then to the DC-DC converter before being sent to the 12v battery. Unlike the energy coming out of a traditional alternator, the energy coming out of the IMA motor goes into a buffer, then comes out through a DC-DC converter. This is why I'd expect to see much more stable voltage in the CR-Z.

at 0.6kWh, the hybrid battery is small. If it weren't receiving this constant trickle charge when not being used, it would slowly drain while cruising. Plus, the IMA motor can likely supply several kilowatts worth of power to the IMA battery, while the DC-DC converter can probably draw 450w maximum, likely less. I doubt that an extra 400w of load would prevent the IMA motor from charging the IMA battery.

I'm certainly not an expert, not by any means. I'm just assuming everything I say based on the knowledge I have about batteries, my experience with the car, and what seems logical to me. The Civic taught me how it feels when a car's voltage is low: Wipers are slow, HID lights sometimes extinguish, fans run slower, etc. I've never experienced that with the 'Z. I'd really like to know more about this, so the best thing, I think, would be to either ask an expert who knows for sure what they're talking about, or ask other members to log their voltages and see their results.

BTW, if anyone wants to ckeck the Excel file, let me know.
[/QUOTE]
 

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She's back together.. runs perfectly. Ginny tryout that trybodin fluid that JB sent me... Car runs great for sitting 1.5 months idle...
 

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Finished silencing driver side door. I didn't do any photos of the progress, because it's basically identical to the passenger side door. Just the final effect with both door handles replaced:

61593


And some before / after

1592960358152.png 1592960369766.png
 

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@Spdbump @MrFastFox666 you guys are both a little right and a little wrong.

Here's the fun about the DC-DC converter. It puts out about 60A when commanded by the IMA ECU (at 14V, 840W). The average alternator puts out about 120A when demanded by the voltage regulator (at 14V, 1.6kW). Obviously at idle speeds, the alternator isn't putting out peak power, but it also maxes out at about 3000 rpm, not all the way up at redline.

The IMA motor is only about 12-15HP, so it stands to reason that it can put out 9-11kW when used for full regen. It usually is not doing regen at full power though. Also worth noting that the DC-DC converter connects the IMA battery to the 12V battery. The IMA motor is not directly connected to the 12V so it really doesn't matter how much juice it puts out.

The amperage output from the converter is available when the IMA ECU feels that there's enough excess energy to put into the 12V battery. The amperage output from an alternator is always available, and the VR doles it out as needed.
 

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@Spdbump @MrFastFox666 you guys are both a little right and a little wrong.

Here's the fun about the DC-DC converter. It puts out about 60A when commanded by the IMA ECU (at 14V, 840W). The average alternator puts out about 120A when demanded by the voltage regulator (at 14V, 1.6kW). Obviously at idle speeds, the alternator isn't putting out peak power, but it also maxes out at about 3000 rpm, not all the way up at redline.

The IMA motor is only about 12-15HP, so it stands to reason that it can put out 9-11kW when used for full regen. It usually is not doing regen at full power though. Also worth noting that the DC-DC converter connects the IMA battery to the 12V battery. The IMA motor is not directly connected to the 12V so it really doesn't matter how much juice it puts out.

The amperage output from the converter is available when the IMA ECU feels that there's enough excess energy to put into the 12V battery. The amperage output from an alternator is always available, and the VR doles it out as needed.
60A seems much more reasonable. I read somewhere that it would only put out 30A, which made no sense to me. Turn on low beams, high beams and fog lights and there's all your 12v power gone, leaving none for anything else.

Also, as far as I know, 2013 and newer U.S models have a more powerful 15kw IMA motor, whereas CR-Zs in other markets, and 2011-2012 models have a 10kw motor.
I'd really like to know more about the system and be able to measure stuff like the pack voltage and current, as well as IMA motor power. I don't have the equipment, though.
 

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Scan Gauge II X gauges are supposed to be able to read some of those other parameters but after following the directions and entering them the CR-Z is not giving the readings I should see. I even wrote an email to the Manufacturer about it and received no answer. :(

At this point I just ignore most of all of this and just drive it. If the voltage ever drops below what i have seen then i will have under hood battery replaced or load tested.

60A seems much more reasonable. I read somewhere that it would only put out 30A, which made no sense to me. Turn on low beams, high beams and fog lights and there's all your 12v power gone, leaving none for anything else.

Also, as far as I know, 2013 and newer U.S models have a more powerful 15kw IMA motor, whereas CR-Zs in other markets, and 2011-2012 models have a 10kw motor.
I'd really like to know more about the system and be able to measure stuff like the pack voltage and current, as well as IMA motor power. I don't have the equipment, though.
 

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Finished silencing driver side door. I didn't do any photos of the progress, because it's basically identical to the passenger side door. Just the final effect with both door handles replaced:

View attachment 61593

And some before / after

View attachment 61594 View attachment 61595

Can you tell a big difference in the road noise? Was it worth the effort? I would think that doing the roof would help with the noise control also.
 

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On those car shows on TV they talk about attaching pieces of the sound deadening material to damp the vibrations across a panel. You do not have to cover a whole panel just a percentage of it. Just something to consider.
 

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Can you tell a big difference in the road noise? Was it worth the effort? I would think that doing the roof would help with the noise control also.
I used some stuff called Tite Seal (read more about it here) on the doors. At least on my CR-Z, it feels like a door is ajar or a window is slightly open when going at highway speeds. The Tite Seal removed this feeling, but didn't reduce noise very much.
 
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