[HondaTuningSuite]

Not quite sure what these tables are, but they are outputs of some sort.
X Axis being RPM, and Y axis is unknown, I haven't seen breakpoints like that, so its definitely something specific to the inverter.

This one is RPM on the Y axis, Unknown X

No idea what this long table is, maybe something with Regeneration.

Then there are these 2 this could be Assist while the following could be Regen

Regen maybe?

 

[da-coder]

Not quite sure what these tables are, but they are outputs of some sort.
X Axis being RPM, and Y axis is unknown, I haven't seen breakpoints like that, so its definitely something specific to the inverter.

Are you using Ghidra for disassembly or something else?
If you want to share the instructions which read this data, i might be able to help there.

Second one might be max regen with X being the battery temps.
This might help:

 

[HondaTuningSuite]

Are you using Ghidra for disassembly or something else?
If you want to share the instructions which read this data, i might be able to help there.

Second one might be max regen with X being the battery temps.
This might help:
View attachment 69835

Temps are usually represented as C with a .1 multiplier, I suppose it could be made granular like that but seems odd.

I use ghidra for reversing the roms, I can share a ghidrazip with you, with the table structures setup but its not a complete rom dump until someone wants to give it a whirl, If you have an Openport 2.0 i can send you app to dump a whole bin with, which would be greatly helpful for some of the context of the rom, since its missing the first 64kb of data.

 

[da-coder]

If you have an Openport 2.0 i can send you app to dump a whole bin with, which would be greatly helpful for some of the context of the rom, since its missing the first 64kb of data.

Sadly I don't. Peter might though.

 

[HondaTuningSuite]

Sadly I don't. Peter might though.

v1 through v1.2 ktuner flash is the same cable, and will work

 

[PeterPerkins]

Is it an open loop or closed loop sensor?

Open loop asfaik. There is no coil around the core..

I will de-solder the chip later.

 

[PeterPerkins]

Interesting tables but I know nothing about roms. I can see a steep learning curve ahead.

I suggest the roms dumps etc and disassembly would be better in a separate dedicated thread or this one will get very confusing.

I don't have an openport 2.

 

[PeterPerkins]

View attachment 69835

Is this for the HCH2 or the CR-Z (Variant?)

 

[HondaTuningSuite]

Interesting tables but I know nothing about roms. I can see a steep learning curve ahead.

I suggest the roms dumps etc and disassembly would be better in a separate dedicated thread or this one will get very confusing.

I don't have an openport 2.

Thats a good idea. I will setup a thread for it, since i want to go as deep as i can into all the available systems, even though i don't have a CRZ, Always wanted one

 

[PeterPerkins]

HCH2 Phase sensor front/rear with IC (ST?) 0540A1 0622 M56 removed.

 

[da-coder]

Is this for the HCH2 or the CR-Z (Variant?)

Good point, it's for a CR-Z. I'm getting off topic.

 

[da-coder]

HCH2 Phase sensor front/rear with IC (ST?) 0540A1 0622 M56 removed.

So i think i've narrowed it down.

amp 2 operating shunt regulator with red thermistor (R3) and R1, R2, VR1, VR2, C1.
amp 3 being run as differential for the hall effect sensor output.
amp 4 not being used (both inputs are Vcc+).

The resistor and capacitor at the bottom (C2, R8) filter feedback for amp 3.

That leaves amp 1 which I think is changing the hall effect sensor's lower voltage input based on R4.
If not, I don't think it's a quad amp IC. It almost lines up perfectly but not quite.

 

[PeterPerkins]

@da-coder so how would you modify that circuit to reduce the voltage swing for a given + or - current?

My idea in the example being simulated in Proteus (used in the G1 and HCH1 and CR-Z so far) is along the line of the below.

The phase sensor is 0-5V output with 2.5V being 0 amps.
So in the simulation with 1.25V input the output is 1.66V

2.5 - 1.66 = 0.84V change instead of 1.25V

67.2% of the voltage swing is being passed through. 32.8% reduction.
67.2% would have to be increased by 50% to get back to 100% = full output.

R3 is already on the main MCM pcb so that is why I added R2 to avoid any offset.

R1 could be variable as the sensor seem to have quite a good current drive capability.
Making R1 variable with the above values would give you a 0 to +50% current adjustment range.

So each sensor needs four tiny resistors adding.


EDIT To make it simpler to implement I would like to swap out the 10k on the MCM board for a 1k. Then add another 1k pull up to +5V.
This reduces the resistor count and complexity. In effect losing R2 & R3 from the above demo circuit.

Sadly though you can't access the 10k without removing the entire pcb from the IGBT modules. So that's not happening.

 

[da-coder]

@da-coder so how would you modify that circuit to reduce the voltage swing for a given + or - current?

Can change the gain on amp 3 by changing R7 and R8.
Transfer function:
Vout = (R7/R5) (V1 - V2) ... R7 = R8, R5 = R6.
So it's a 1:1 change depending on R7.
i.e.:
change output by 2/3...
Vout1 = (2/3) Vout2 ... R7 is the only changing value --> R7.1.
(R7/R5) (V1 - V2) = (2/3) (R7.1/R5) (V1 - V2)
(R7/R5) (V1 - V2) = (2/3) (R7.1/R5) (V1 - V2)
(R7) = (2/3) (R7.1)

I'd suggest just soldering a new resistor in parallel over each.
A 660kΩ (or 680kΩ) on top of R7 and R8 should cause the output to decrease by the same amount as yours.

With desoldering we just need close to 220kΩ in their places.

 

[PeterPerkins]

I shall solder in a few resistors and see what happens to the output voltage with my fixed current tests. 10,20,30A etc

 

[PeterPerkins]

A variable solution would be good. I wonder if some SPI controlled digipots can be attached on a little daughterboard. Or some other sort of switchable stepped solution.

In the earlier models and the crz you can't have more than a certain % current increase at start up as the current into a stopped motor during the start cycle is too high and the mcm sets an igbt short code.

Once the motor is turning the back emf means you can dial up more current increase.

 

[PeterPerkins]

Hacking some 270k resistors into the R7 & R8 positions instead of the 330K oem ones gave a current detection reduction of about 20% which equates to a current increase of +25%.

That's probably a good starting point for testing in the car. I have ordered a selection of smd resistors for further testing.

It's possible to do this mod as well with the inverter pcb in position which is great. A steady hand and good eyesight is needed..

Anyway no point getting ahead of myself I need to see if the CR-Z will accept the HCH2 IMA setup in standard form first or this is all academic.

I think I might have just bought a whole car.

 

[da-coder]

A variable solution would be good. I wonder if some SPI controlled digipots can be attached on a little daughterboard. Or some other sort of switchable stepped solution.

Well if we aren't worried about EMF interference we can just make one board and run wires from each digital potentiometer to be in parallel (or replace) those 6 resistors.
Then have one microcontroller run all 6.
Could possibly run shielded cables too.

Hacking some 270k resistors into the R7 & R8 positions instead of the 330K oem ones gave a current detection reduction of about 20% which equates to a current increase of +25%.
It's possible to do this mod as well with the inverter pcb in position which is great. A steady hand and good eyesight is needed..

Good to hear!

I think I might have just bought a whole car.

 

[da-coder]

If we want to go variable we should go with what you suggested earlier as it's much easier to wire up.
EDIT: removed for simplicity
I'd use an Arduino and an AD5206.

 

[PeterPerkins]

We are def worried about EMI/EMF it's a noise nightmare in the IMA power control zone.
Over 15 years of trying to make gadgets work near the IMA has taught me a lot LOL..
Inside the Inverter sitting on top of the IGBT's is about as near to hell on earth as it gets!

I only talk PIC so would not be using an Arduino in any prototypes.

I'm not sure mine is easier.
Your resistor substitution avoids track cutting and also keeps the layout totally OEM etc.

I think I will try +25% first, if that works then I might consider a variable setup.

I need to investigate the battery current sensor now.