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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Does anyone else experience strange acceleration shortly after left foot braking? How about while rev-matching a down-shift while braking upon entry?

I'm taking my car to a dealership in a few minutes to see if this is an intended thing, or just a bug. I'm just worried everyone in the dealership isn't going to understand left foot braking.
 

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^That's how I do it in the S. I know the pro's use their right toe on the gas and right heel on the brake, but I just have trouble getting my right foot to do that. I find the method as shown above to works better for me.
 

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Does anyone else experience strange acceleration shortly after left foot braking? How about while rev-matching a down-shift while braking upon entry?

I'm taking my car to a dealership in a few minutes to see if this is an intended thing, or just a bug. I'm just worried everyone in the dealership isn't going to understand left foot braking.
I'm guessing the engineers that designed the regen/assist software never considered that the break and gas peddles could be used at the same time, or if they did they decided there was only one way to handle the situation.

I think what you are experiencing is the switch for generating power to supplying power from the electric motor/generator.

You may have to adjust your technique so that both peddles are not pressed at the same time. Works for me when in heavy stop an go traffic. But that wont help for matching revs during down shifts.
I to would be great if the way that this happens changed when in sports mode.
It definitely would make it hard to bump draft;)
 

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actually if you watch a lot of japanese guys they will do it as pictured. Thats how i do it. I have no intention of learning giving gas with the side of my foot and braking with the ball of my foot. It just seems like more could go wrong. Also my feet arent wide enough :hiding:
 

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actually if you watch a lot of japanese guys they will do it as pictured. Thats how i do it. I have no intention of learning giving gas with the side of my foot and braking with the ball of my foot. It just seems like more could go wrong. Also my feet arent wide enough :hiding:
Its not that your feet arent wide enough they just have to design the peddles far apart so the average driver wont hit them at the same time.

Try Driving a formula Ford Swift DB1, if you are not waring driving shoes you will be pressing the break and the gas at the same time.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
So, does anyone else experience the gas pedal going dead for up to two seconds after left foot braking? I assumed it was the regenerative subroutine kicking in, and not knowing what to do with the additional input, but then I considered the number of people who have mistakenly pressed both the brake and the gas in the past (think Audi) and chaos ensued.


Yes, I know there are different downshifting techniques, but I'm accustomed to a much different setup when I'm driving hard. It's a street-car, and I normally don't wear driving shoes while on the street (save for autocross, that's technically street.) I'm comfortable with LFB, so much that I don't even think about it after I've gotten into the proper gear. It doesn't make sense to lose that extra 1/10th of a second of acceleration because you can't move your foot fast enough, and you're losing the load on the engine and thus boost.

I guess it's something I'll have to put up with.

Unless you do not need to downshift during braking.
Truth. With gears as long as the cr-z, there isn't much shifting going on on back roads, except for the pre-corner entry shift, which I do before I touch the brakes. Hence the LFB.

This thread isn't about the "right way to drive." I just want to know if it's a software defined thing, or if something is wrong with my vehicle.
 

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When I autoX my CVT (granted only twice so far), I left foot brake and do not have any problems with the gas pedal not responding.
 

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As I have the CVT, I can't say that I have experienced that, but I do believe it is possible. The computer thinks it knows best even if it is wrong.
The CVT does give strange results some times. It will some times not upshift with or with out the paddles after down shifting before a corner then feathering the throttle through the corner.
 

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Unless you do not need to downshift during braking.
I dont get this... Ive never left foot braked, nor do i see a need to left foot brake. I have never in my 10 years of driving standard driven along with my foot on the gas and thought "wow it would be really great to slam on the brakes right now".

And my left foot is so used to pushing the clutch right to the floor i dont really have much fine feeling and finessing you need with a braking foot to avoid an accident...

I dont understand how you think that using your left foot for braking could possibly be a better idea than just driving the way the car is designed to be driven.

Do you left foot brake in an automatic? You shouldnt. Look on canadas worst driver. 80% of the people on that show were left foot brakers...

Honestly, i dont care how you drive. But if you cause an accident because of left foot braking you deserve everything you get. Furthermore, if you mess up your car or complain that your brakes wear out too fast because your riding the brakes you wont get any sympathy from me.

Go pedal=go
stop pedal=stop.
Stop+go=stuff getting preworn, increasing fuel enonomy, stress on trans. etc.

theres a reason we use the left foot for clutch only...
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·

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WIKI said:
Many commentators advise against the use of left-foot braking while driving on public roads.[7][8]

However, some commentators do recommend left-foot braking as routine practice when driving vehicles fitted with an automatic transmission, when manoeuvering at low speeds.[9]

Proponents of the technique note that in low-speed manoeuvers, a driver of a vehicle with a manual transmission will usually keep a foot poised over the clutch pedal, ready to disengage power when the vehicle nears an obstacle. This means that disengagement is also possible in the event of malfunction such as an engine surge. However, the absence of a clutch on a vehicle with automatic transmission means that there is no such safety override, unless the driver has a foot poised over the brake pedal.[9]

Critics of the technique suggest that it can cause confusion when switching to or from a vehicle with a manual transmission,[7] and that it is difficult to achieve the necessary sensitivity to brake smoothly when your left foot is used to operating a clutch pedal.
Sounds like bad idea written all over it... Race technique or not, the CRZ isnt a race car. And sure its fun to do a little heel toe, But risking causing a huge accident because you wanted to brake a little fancy just angers me.

just drive like a normal human being.

If you are autocrossing, then please post it in the autocross thread to avoid confusion.
 

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WIKI said:
This means that disengagement is also possible in the event of malfunction such as an engine surge.
and this is exactly what you are complaining about? NOT SAFE. Honda will tell you not to left foot brake. I dont understand how taking the car to the dealership complaining its not working right when you arent driving it right in the first place.
 

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i have no track time in a car.

I'll play your angle, track time means no insurance, no warranty. You broke something racing, then dont expect honda to jump and replace things for free. the CRZ is not a race car.

also in your OP you never said you were on the track. obviously im going to assume you driving on open public roads.
 

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Closer pedal placement is what you want with a heel and toe method. Thus the reason race pedals are so close together.

And I have used my left foot to brake in my S during autoX runs when a down shift isn't needed. You save the time it take to move from the brake pedal to the gas pedal when you already have your right foot over the gas pedal. How much time does it save? Very little, but 0.8 of a second is a lifetime in autoXing so every little bit helps... if you care about such things.
 

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i have no track time in a car.

I'll play your angle, track time means no insurance, no warranty. You broke something racing, then dont expect honda to jump and replace things for free. the CRZ is not a race car.

also in your OP you never said you were on the track. obviously im going to assume you driving on open public roads.
The warranty book says something along the lines of 'will not replace or repair parts that failed due to competition'. Many things that happen on the track are specifically not competition, but driver education of experience.

About the only place I left foot brake is on the Shenandoah Circuit at Summit Point where there are many corners that only require me to drop a bit of speed in my race car. It provides for quicker and smoother transitions. While I feel comfortable trail-braking with my left foot, I do not feel comfortable threshold braking. I do practice left foot braking on the street as so as to maintain my ability (but not trail-braking, as you hopefully could guess).

While braking with your left foot is not common, the car should not show such problems.
 

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I haven't felt the need to try it yet, but I'm thinking that the brake and accelerator pedals on the CR-Z are probably too far offset for heel-and-toe; the brake pedal is quite a bit closer.

I did a lot of track and rally racing in my youth, and have the brain damage to show for it, but no autocross so can't speak for that. There is a place for left foot braking but personally I've only ever used it to stabilise a rally car without coming off the throttle. On the track, I think the only time I'd even think about using it would be taking a fast corner that required very slight slowing, but when lifting off is likely to unsettle the rear end. That sounds like what's being described. I'd either take a more sympathetic line or feather the throttle, but I could see more aggressive styles incorporating something like that. I'm not sure there's a need for it in a FWD car like the CR-Z, but it would help you develop the left foot sensitivity you'd need to do it racing.

As for the actual issue muddy is experiencing, my guess would be that the IMA was categorically not designed with something like this in mind. What's probably happening is that because you're slowing with the throttle still on, as soon as you release the brake, the car thinks that you've actually got quite a lot of throttle on compared to your speed and assumes you want to accelerate hard, giving a boost from the electric motor. The way the car chooses to use the electric motor appears to be quite complex though, so this might be an oversimplification.
 
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