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Oh....forgot you were still wanting to sell your CR-Z. DON'T!

Every time I see an S2000, I wonder why I never bought one. Love 'em, but it always came down to the "uni" test--I couldn't fit my unicycle in there (unless it went in the passenger's seat--and that was the only deal-breaker. Saw a yellow one through the garage door while at the Dealership, picking up my painted rear wing. I didn't see the S2000 that belongs to they guy in the paint shop, but it's heavily modified; putting out about 550 bhp.:surprise:
 

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Discussion Starter #102
For now i don't need much space, nor am i doing more than 15km a day.
I've got some cash on the side, that's enough to pay for the rest of my car.

So yeah selling is just secondary, as it will be fully paid within the next year or so.

I know the S2000 is valueing here, might be just speculation pricing, but the fact is that prices are going up, and good ones will be scarce to find, and importing will be out of the question.

My last hope, is that when i drive an S2000, i'll hate it, and drop the idea.
I definetely woulnd't be changing anything to the car, and want to keep it original.

But i "don't need" a weekend car, cause my daily commute is so short, that most of the times, it's shorter than what "weekend cars" have to run. It's just the feeling of "the one thing" that you want to have, since i was 12, and the wish kinda stayed.

- If i intended to buy the new Civic, in a loan, it would cost me around 30.000€

- If i keep my CR-Z ( valued 12.500€ on the low ball) and got an s2000 aswell ( 18.000€), i would be an happier camper for the same amount.

The problem about selling the car, don't know if you guys ever had that feeling, I don't want to sell it to just anybody, that will trash the car and total it in the first month. Also not feeling like selling it for the same amount, as normie CR-Z's are beeing sold for.

It's a fcked up decision.
There's also the clichet, about the mid life crysis, where you by a convertible sports car at 50 years old. So i was thinking of getting ahead, and just run it at 30 years old, and get it over with :D
 

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Yeah, get that S2000 and keep the CR-Z--you'll enjoy both when the actual mid-life crisis come around. My CR-Z is my (late) mid-life crisis machine!:smile2:
 

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If I were you, I wouldn't trade in the "Z" for any kind of Civic. The CR-Z is much more unique and You can't buy a new one or equal to yours anymore in Europe. I would enjoy it as far as I can :) You can buy a Civic whenever you want later. Keep the "Z" and buy the S2K also, than You'll have 2 gorgeus Honda! :smile2:
 

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Discussion Starter #105
The dream is getting some form now.
Let's see if i'll manage to make it happen this year before my 30th birthday.

Then i'd have to terminate the car "chapter" of my life, and just enjoy those two beautys.

And in the far future have someone say... My grandpa drives an s2000. like a bause :D
 

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Discussion Starter #106
So i went to tryout an S2000 yesterday.
I was fairly excited about it, but when i got there the guy was saying that he couldn't let me test drive the car.
Because it was a dangerous car, and that there were many ppl interested, and he couldn't let everyone that came up drive it...bla bla..

I managed to convice him to let me drive it, as no one buys a car that they can't test drive imo.

So the First thing i notice, and that made be a bit reluctant...My ****ing knees hit the steering wheel. I feel like i'm driving a kid bike :\.
Space wise i fealt that even though it is confortable, it doesn't have much space for me as a driver, compared to what we are used to in the Cr-Z.

I do love the car, locally it's on a reasonably Ok price.
Found the normal wear and tear due to age, some "chrome" parts are chipped. the leather seats are not mint. The paint could use a clean up, but since it's grey, i would probably have it red painted.
The driving itself was quite different from the Z of course.
The nose fealt a lot longer, and the steering fealt super light and high responsive. Not sure if it's from beeing an Ap1.
I definetely fealt that kick, from old Gas cars without electrical assists, it definetely fealt good and Fresh.

Personaly i didn't find the gearbox that enjoyable. I know people say it's highly precise, and something of the other world...but I enjoy the CR-Z gearbox better. Spot on.

I din't get to push the car, as the dealer was already Scared, and tbh so was i. Whenever i'm driving someone else's car.

I certainly enjoyed the tryout, but i'm somewhat devided.

I'm not sure anymore, that i can stick to "just" the s2000. Maybe if my Z was stock i would feel more inclined, but since it's on similar performance levels, i'm having more trouble decide.

Another question that is bugging me, is that if, that S2000 is the one for me. Considering it's a year 2000 with 176.000km, and the condition is "Ok", i didn't get the feeling that it was like that WOW deal.

CR-Z Update:


Noticed a funny thing while launching into the highway.
Since i'm using my front parking sensors with the Beep ON, When i launch, it makes such a considerable pressure, that the sensors assume there's a solid object approaching, and Beep the **** out when i'm doing 0-100 hahah. So funny

I'm still enjoying the car, and locally haven't seen any other Cr-Z's for a while. I know they are out there, but i don't usually cross paths with them. Sure does feel nice this kind of uniqueness around here.

Until i decide what to do with the whole, S2000 Cr-z scenario, i don't have any imediate mods on the agenda.
Would definetely love to get some clazzios, a better exhaust system, and finish it with a retune.

Waiting for better weather, and "courage" to do some new 0-100kmh vids. Have been driving at 50kmh for almost two months, and need to stretch the legs hehe.
 

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Discussion Starter #107
So, i'm guessing my 12v Dieded Dead tonight. R.I.P.
Just as i was going out to work, and sat on the car, turned the key, and the christmas light spectacle started
:crying:

It's not the first time it drained out, but since i don't measure it "regularly" it's hard to say, if it was over 3 nights, or over the 3-5 months since last time it went dead.

I'm still unsure if it needs a new battery, or if another charge up will do the trick.


I'm pretty sure what's "killing" it for me, is that even though i use the car 5 days a week, it's always for 2x 11minute trips. So maybe the 12v doesn't have time to recharge? To be honest, since i stopped randomly driving to the coast once a week, for a cruise, which was about 1:30 of trip and return, this started happening.

Also since i bought the car, it still has the same battery. I think it was changed back in 2012, and never again to the day. Might also be it.

The car always sits outdoors, with 30ºC weather, and some times 0ºC nights, not sure if that matters. As it's not that extreme weather. Just some ocasional Hot/cold treatment during spring/winter.

What would you guys suggest?
I know that if i go to the dealership here, they'll say something like "you need a special kind of battery due to Start/stop" and charge me 170€ like they did my father.

From searching the web, i got price ranges for Batteries with 45mah 340CCa, ranging from 40€ to 150€.
Also have been reading what's on the forum regarding replacement batteries, but didn't find any consensus on Which to chose. Does brand matter? is a bigger battery really worth it? Should i just stick to OEM?or just OEM alike.
 

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Two words Load Test. :|

Don't just check the voltage that can read fine but under load drop to a voltage too low to run the electronics.

The more times the battery is run very low the more chance of a cell failing or reversing polarity.:nerd:

So, i'm guessing my 12v Dieded Dead tonight. R.I.P.
Just as i was going out to work, and sat on the car, turned the key, and the christmas light spectacle started
:crying:

It's not the first time it drained out, but since i don't measure it "regularly" it's hard to say, if it was over 3 nights, or over the 3-5 months since last time it went dead.

I'm still unsure if it needs a new battery, or if another charge up will do the trick.


I'm pretty sure what's "killing" it for me, is that even though i use the car 5 days a week, it's always for 2x 11minute trips. So maybe the 12v doesn't have time to recharge? To be honest, since i stopped randomly driving to the coast once a week, for a cruise, which was about 1:30 of trip and return, this started happening.

Also since i bought the car, it still has the same battery. I think it was changed back in 2012, and never again to the day. Might also be it.

The car always sits outdoors, with 30ºC weather, and some times 0ºC nights, not sure if that matters. As it's not that extreme weather. Just some ocasional Hot/cold treatment during spring/winter.

What would you guys suggest?
I know that if i go to the dealership here, they'll say something like "you need a special kind of battery due to Start/stop" and charge me 170€ like they did my father.

From searching the web, i got price ranges for Batteries with 45mah 340CCa, ranging from 40€ to 150€.
Also have been reading what's on the forum regarding replacement batteries, but didn't find any consensus on Which to chose. Does brand matter? is a bigger battery really worth it? Should i just stick to OEM?or just OEM alike.
 

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Discussion Starter #109
Two words Load Test. :|

Don't just check the voltage that can read fine but under load drop to a voltage too low to run the electronics.

The more times the battery is run very low the more chance of a cell failing or reversing polarity.:nerd:
Don't think i have any tool to do a load test with.

The charger read 9.4 V, so yeah, didn't had startup. I left it charging, slooooooooowly.
I'll see how it goes after it's done.

The battery "eye" indicator, says the battery is OK though.
No need charge,nor water.
Yesterday i was searching for battery brands, and found out that the batteries we get here for the CR-Z in Portugal, are from Yuasa, which seemed like a motorcycle/lawn mower batteries :S
Always learning
 

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Brand is pretty much irrelevant these days. If it has the eye it may just be old and some cells may not be working. The "eye" only monitors one cell. If you get the car running again go to any auto parts place or mechanic and have the battery load tested with the car not running! I had a dealer test it running and of course that will not read the under hood battery.

We do not need a very big battery just 12.x volts enough to run the electronics then the CR-Z uses the big 1xx Volt IMA battery

Good luck. I hope it all works out but if this has happened more than 2 times if it were me I would just proactively replace the battery.

Don't think i have any tool to do a load test with.

The charger read 9.4 V, so yeah, didn't had startup. I left it charging, slooooooooowly.
I'll see how it goes after it's done.

The battery "eye" indicator, says the battery is OK though.
No need charge,nor water.
Yesterday i was searching for battery brands, and found out that the batteries we get here for the CR-Z in Portugal, are from Yuasa, which seemed like a motorcycle/lawn mower batteries :S
Always learning
 

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Discussion Starter #111
Just a small Update.

My 12v Battery issue, seems to be controlled, i've driven longer in the last month, with a couple of longer trips, of about 1h, or 2h, which seems to have been the problem this whole time.
They say the car needs to be driven atleast 30 minutes, but i guess that needs to be 30 minutes in the same trip.

Otherwise, repeatedly driving it for 10-15 minutes, might cause your battery to drain out eventualy.


Anyway onto other matters.


I'll be talking/negotiating with the tuner where i had my car dynoed. We have some talking and planning to do, as i'm to rework by Exhaust line all the way from the turbo manifold and backwards.
He believes that my tune, is very conservative, and RAW. It should be fine tuned.
Some areas are running to rich, and the whole map in general.
I've also did some research on my own, and noticed that my ignition maps, weren't changed, they are still stock, which i believe is somewhat odd, in a forced induction build.


Anyway with this said, and thinking about the clutch "problem", here are some options that i presented and others that he thinks possible:

-Reduce the boost, but maintain the HP (because 200 is a magic number )
-Increase the Horsepower through fine tuning, with the same boost
-Keep as is, just more linear and refined
-De tune for 180ish horsepower like the new civic


So these are somewhat the options presented, and although i still have to discuss details with him, it's somewhat what it is planned for my car.
I don't see myself buying a new clutch just yet, because it's a bit expensive to import it, and for the use i give to the car, how short my trips are, i don't see it beeing a problem anytime soon.

I'm strongly inclined, for the the first option, of reducing boost, and maintaining HP, with or without torque loss. if this option goes well i strongly think that, not only will it fix the clutch issue, but it will also give me even better fuel economy and reliability.


So....stay tuned ;)
 

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That's an interesting set of possibilities and I would choose to reduce the boost for reliability purposes if the engine is stock, especially a 2011 one.

What I learned with my tune is that the stock ignition tables are horrible but the fuelling is very accurate once the injectors are scaled for near-zero trim. So I don't doubt that you can do better as mine has been transformed with very smooth ignition tables and a progressive feel to making, err, progress!
 

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Discussion Starter #113
Although mine is a 2011, it has now less than 45.000km. So the engine is almost new.
But from all the options i think the more interesting one was the one you pointed out aswell.

Less boost, with the same HP would be the best of both worlds. And if it fixes the clutch issues, even a better deal.


I saw some guys had installed the Greddy kit, with values of 185hp and 190lbs of torque.
So i wonder if they will have any clutch issues. considering it's making the same torque as mine but just a little less hp and everything on the car is stock. Even injectors they said.

 

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I wish for that torque, but you can't have everything!
 

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Discussion Starter #115
I wish for that torque, but you can't have everything!
It is fun, i won't lie.

But if it has to be a bit sacrificed in order to shield the clutch. So be it.
also notice as the graph from Kamispeed, is almost as linear as a supercharger?

Pretty sweet to have a turbo setup so linear.
On the other hand, since it has almost MAX torque through the entire band, makes me question about their clutch.
@KamiSpeed

Can you guys test this?
We are trying to figure out here how much torque can the clutch hold consistently.
I know Nightwish is making more torque, but he also confirms that after 1H or so, the clutch starts slipping if you go WOT
 

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I have seen turbo cars with a flat torque 'curve' - my Rover 620ti from years ago had it. It sometimes means it was electronically controlled in the ECU so as not to break something, like the gearbox.
 

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Discussion Starter #117
I have seen turbo cars with a flat torque 'curve' - my Rover 620ti from years ago had it. It sometimes means it was electronically controlled in the ECU so as not to break something, like the gearbox.
Smart stuff, that should also be available on our tuning options.
Hondata is still very limited on what allows you to do.


My tuner mentioned reducing boost where the area has a torque spike, as to make it more linear reducing slip chance.
As i've tried before, i can accelerate a bit gentler, with a bit less boost, and the clutch holds really fine, so i guess it's a matter of playing with boost, and find that sweet spot, just to go a bit below into the safety threshold.


Will be interesting to compare the maps after, as they were tuned from two very distinct professionals.
Maybe a night and day difference
 

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Discussion Starter #118
Soooooo, after much thought, research, consideration, saving, and craze from de moditis flu.......
I've placed my order at nengun for an ORC Light clutch, the high crimp type, which should be good for about 300hp and 300ish nm torque. Should leave me with a fat safety margin when it comes to longevity/wear.

I was checking out earlier SPEC clutches, but then found ORC clutches from Japan, at about the same price. So i chose from Japan.
I know they are far more expensive in the US, because they are imported form Japan, but in my case, between importing from the US, or importing ORC from Japan, for the same price, i guess it's a no brainer.

I was also checking between ORc Light clutch, and Orc metal clutch, but after doing some reading and enquiring around, Since i'm no race driver, i found the Light clutch option to better suit my needs, considering it's a daily car, and ocasionally there are some traffic lights, compromising with a Metal clutch, just didn't make that much sense to me. So that's it.

It should take between 15-30 days for it to arrive, and it's still quite an investment for me.


Plan wise, i still need to find where i'll be re working my exhaust, I really wish i had the tools to weld, and make my own exhaust hehe, that way it would really be up to spec.


After installing the clutch ( hope everything goes well with it), and sorting my exhaust, then all that's left is a trip to the tuner, to fine tune it, and possibily unlock safely some of the left potential.



Well that's it ^^
Looking forward to my clutch.
 

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You made the right choice with the clutch!

My SPEC was 90% of the reason I went K-series. It ruined my flywheel, and I'm convinced it took it's toll on my driveshafts which also led to premature failure.

ORC was my go-to if I had kept the LEA in the car! Nice piece of kit.
 

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Discussion Starter #120
You made the right choice with the clutch!

My SPEC was 90% of the reason I went K-series. It ruined my flywheel, and I'm convinced it took it's toll on my driveshafts which also led to premature failure.

ORC was my go-to if I had kept the LEA in the car! Nice piece of kit.
I couldn't find much information though, but your opinion reassures me quite a bit.

I was even searching YouTube for clutch sound videos and there were a few complaining about spec clutches, and then issues with customer service when the problems occurred. To be fair it's still 100€ difference between the two, but ogura inspired me with more confidence.

I even asked the nengum team about which one was better the light or the metal series, and for my car values either would do. But considering the pedal behavior and the daily usage I chose the light clutch for the organic properties, and advertised "close to OEM feel".

Just for information purposes:

Spec in the US stage 2: 500€ - imported 850€.
Ogura in US - 1000€ - imported to Europe from Japan 959€
Oh and lol factor:

HKS light action clutch imported to Europe: >1500€
 
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