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CR-Z Racing 2013 Edition

19K views 51 replies 17 participants last post by  atifn79 
#1 ·
I am very backlogged with posts, so no better way then to just start.

My first adventure of the year was a 2 day HPDE track day present from the wife. It was thru The Drivers Edge at MSR Houston. My Z1 tires were pretty worn out and I didn't want to drive 500+miles plus 2 track days on them. So how to get 4 spare tires/rims plus a cooler, bags, racing junk, chairs and the wife all packed on the CR-Z?

First pack 2 tires and everything else in the trunk. Tight fit.

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Then attach a Hollywood Racks F6 Expedition 3-Bike Trunk/Bumper Mount Rack. I placed 3M Door Edge adhesive on the edges where the clips mounted so it would not scratch the paint. Ghetto Tire Rack was better than mounting a tow bar and adding weight.



It has worked out well with over 1300 miles of carrying tires/rims and it sure beats having the wife ride on the bike rack.

More in a bit.
 
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#6 ·
The Drivers Edge MSR Houston.

This was a 2 day event for under $400. I would recommend The Drivers Edge if you want to get started in track days. The in car instruction will vary depending on who you get regardless of which company is putting on the HPDE event, but The Drivers Edge does classroom lessons between sessions that are great. To me it put them a step above the other 2 companies I have done HPDE with in the past.

Change to DOT 4 brake fluid before you go... brakes giving out on you is scary.

Anyway, the track has 4 fairly long straights, 1 long sweeper, 2 tight turns and a back section that reminds me of an AutoX course. I could keep up with even a Porsche GT3 on the AutoX section, hold my own in the turns, but get left behind in the straights. No surprises there. The car is well balanced, behaves great... just needs more power.

Morning session video from green group. Other sessions are on my Youtube Channel.


The big lesson learned... get on the gas early before straights. Sacrifice just a little bit of speed during a turn if it allows you to adjust your line and get on the gas earlier on the exit.

Below is a great example. 2 different laps. You can see by now my line is pretty consistent. Both laps look about the same. The difference is that I get on the gas earlier in the turn on the top video. The net result is a 100 foot difference by the end of the straight.



More later
 
#8 ·
Great videos, and explanation. Makes me wanna try!

And of course you have to take your wife. Besides the fact it was her present to you, someone has to take the photo's. :p

Thanks for sharing.
 
#9 ·
One of my goals in autocrossing is to see if I can be competitive in my CR-Z on a national level, with the Minis that have dominated the class for the last 10 years. This is only my third year of autocrossing, so this is an ambitious goal... but why not try?

I spent about 8 months on the stock ultra-mpg tires that came with the car. They were craptastic for AutoX, but they gave great audio feedback and they helped teach me when I was doing something wrong. I then got a set of Dunlop Z1 Star Specs. Still street tires, but with much more grip, and thus were faster. I ran those for about 8 months before the outside edges were worn, then I flipped them on the rims and ran another 4 months.

I finally set my sights on a good opportunity to compete against some national level guys in HS at the Sun Belt National Tour. I bought some used Hoosier A6s and ran 2 local events to get the feel of the new tires. I was as ready as I could be at this point.

The week before the event everyone in HS bailed. Some didn't show and some changed classes. This included a previous national champion and 2 other Mini drivers who are pretty bad-ass. Anyway, I competed in HS against a guy in a Mazda 3 who didn't even show up the 2nd day.

The event went well. My PAX ranking was 33 out of 155 putting me in the top 25%. I was beat by 2 Minis on street tires however. David Hedderick had the best PAX of the whole event and Joseph Austin was 14th. I was a full 5.5 seconds behind David (who was a full 1.5 sec ahead of 2nd place). So how close am I?

Well I know I could go at lease 2 seconds faster. My final time was my best run from Saturday added to my best run on Sunday. Both of these was the 2nd of 3 runs. Each day I had a better run going in the 3rd run, but threw it away with a terrible turn. Lets assume my driving progresses to the point that I don't make that kind of novice mistake anymore. 2 seconds faster would have put me ahead of Joseph and at 13th in PAX. I was also on (at this point) very used Hoosiers. There were cords showing after my final run. There is some more time to be had with new Hoosiers.

Do I think I can compete with the CR-Z? Yeah, I think I could compete. I might even be able to get a trophy in a few years. Will I? Probably not. At least not in H-Stock as it is now (there are proposed changes for next year). I corded a set of tires after about 35 runs (12 before I got them and 23 after). That is about $28 a run. 28 dollars per 45 seconds! I ain't got money for that.

If the proposed changes come thru, stock classes will be allowed camber plates. That will really help out with tire wear. It will probably also mean street tires instead of R-Comps (Hoosiers). They are much cheaper and last A LOT longer. There are more changes proposed, but those are the biggies for me. If those come thru I will give it another run. But until then, I need to find a sponsor.

Best run from Day 1 of the Sun Belt Tour. Camera issues on 2nd day.



PS - I got Zedd up on scales at the event. Curb weight was a tad over 2600 pounds with 1/4 tank of fuel and everything that wasn't bolted down taken out of the car. 1600 pounds up front, 1000 in the back. Added probably a pound of magnetic decals for the event.

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#11 ·
One useful piece of info I have come across... I forgot to use my ATEQ Quickset at the last event after changing rims/tires. I ran 6 runs and never got an error, so I decided to do a test... it takes about 20 minutes of driving before the car will recognize that you are running the wrong TPMS and throw the code.

So for autocross you can change rims at an event and not worry that traction control will stay on. Can anyone else confirm this?
 
#14 ·
For me, it only takes about 2 blocks to have the TPMS light come on after changing tires and not changing the settings with Quickset. So I can't imagine this would work, but my car may be different. I did notice that tire position does not matter, so rotating race (or daily driver) tires works fine without going back and changing the Quickset settings on the computer.

Next time I change out, I can see if I come up with a similar result.

B
 
#12 · (Edited)
I took my CRZ to the first WAI (MKE) race for 2013. This is the first time I tried using the paddles (on my CVT) and it was a major disappointment. The shifting algorithm is pretty useless (IMHO). I was using "SPORT" mode with traction off. It is great that there is an "automatic" upshift before redline...obviously needed to avoid engine damage and easier than actually timing the up paddle. But there is also an upshift on lift (at least in "2nd") which is a total waste. Once I am in a "gear" set, I want to stay there to redline. The "2nd" setting would easily be good up to like 50mph before redline, and that's where I wanted to stay. But I continually found myself in "3rd" or worse. I think there might be an input to the computer using vacuum, and maybe there is a way to get around that (temporarily block vacuum input)...?? Or maybe there is a way to change the ECU program to modify the algorithm...?? But something would be needed. I tried continually hitting the down paddle, but that didn't seem to help, and probably just made the setting change mechanism add more delays...not sure.

So I went back to my "standby" of using the "L" setting. That actually worked best (1.5 sec better than paddles), and I have some video showing that the engine RPMs stayed in a really good zone using L, at least for this race (4500 to 6500RPM). I ended up with a 2nd in my class (F-HS), but about 1.6 seconds out of first and getting into the top 20 PAX. I ended up around 42 PAX (of 122 drivers) which is a little better than my Insight, but not by a substantially significant amount. Getting another 1.6 seconds might be remotely possible with the CRZ, but it will be a real struggle.

I'll post links to the videos (one with paddles, and one with "L") when I get around to putting them together.

B
 
#15 ·
With a little more analysis of the videos, I think I see what is happening. It looks like the upshift algorithm is taking 6K RPM as the redline and shifting to "3" at that point (about 44MPH). Problem is that when speed comes down to about 40MPH, the engine RPM is too low (4K RPM). So the "3" range is really lousy. In comparison, the "L" setting will gladly allow the engine to go to redline (about 6K RPM again), and must employ a rev limiter to protect the engine. Without a shift, everything is mostly good to stay in a useful range of RPMs. Problem is that if speed gets too low in "L", there is no option to shift to "1" to get to higher RPMs, so lugging is possible.

So using the paddles doesn't appear to be an issue with upshift on lift, but truly an upshift on "redline", with the "3" "gear" being a real dog. The solution to this would be to disable automatic upshift (at least for going from "2" to "3") and count on the rev limiter to save the engine. Not sure if it's possible, and, if so, it might require paddle control for both up and (occasional) down shift between 2 and 1, avoiding 3 at almost all costs (for short AX tracks, at least).

B
 
#17 ·
Nice videos bluesight. It is really great to see someone else out there with a CR-Z and sharing info. I tried the paddle shifters quite a few times, but don't use them unless I need a "dash to the finish" at the end of a course. It is too hard to shift them when needed if your are not going in a straight line and the shifters are where you expect them to be. Also, the car will upshift on its own (like you suspected) if your RPM goes too high.

The CVT really sux off the line, but I think it makes up for it during the course. We are at near optimal RPM thru most of the course thanks to the CVT doing its thing. I just stick it in D and go... but I will try L this weekend and see if that feels any different.

I see you are running with 2 cameras... try moving one so you can see your hands. I feel I got a lot better by watching (afterwards) what kind of inputs I was making with the steering wheel. It was a lot easier for me to watch the video later and see where I was chopping at the wheel to correct something.
 
#18 ·
A nice little course this weekend. I believe this is my best ever PAX showing in dry weather. 14 of 120. I am starting to think long sweepers are an area where I could be faster. I seem to do better on courses that have more slaloms and transition elements. I didn't hit a cone all day... so lesson the of the week is be more aggressive.



Tire update:

The 205/24/16 A6 Hoosiers are corded on inside and out now so they are pretty much done. I got a cheap pair of used A6s in 245/45/16 that I will try to cram on... that will be interesting. I finally found the sweet spot with tire pressure. Now I can get the back end to come out when I want it... just as the tires die hehe. The wider A6s will need even more pressure I think.
 
#19 ·
That is a really great, and encouraging result. Need to work harder on my 1.6 seconds...

B

A nice little course this weekend. I believe this is my best ever PAX showing in dry weather. 14 of 120. I am starting to think long sweepers are an area where I could be faster. I seem to do better on courses that have more slaloms and transition elements. I didn't hit a cone all day... so lesson the of the week is be more aggressive.
...
 
#20 ·
The Austin club had event #4. I shoved some used 245/45/16 Hoosier A6s onto our stock rims. Man they look goofy, but they sure are sticky!!! I had to throw the car around like a crazy person to get the back end to come out... what a blast. No rubbing so I am happy. The course was awesome. Probably one of my favorites ever so far. PAX was 13 of 135.

The wide tires were no where near as responsive as the 205s I was running. I have some video that shows why that I will post tomorrow. But they sure do grip around the sweepers.



Notice the klag trying to come off the passenger rear.
 
#21 ·
Another great result. Did you try "L" on any of the runs?

B

The Austin club had event #4. I shoved some used 245/45/16 Hoosier A6s onto our stock rims. Man they look goofy, but they sure are sticky!!! I had to throw the car around like a crazy person to get the back end to come out... what a blast. No rubbing so I am happy. The course was awesome. Probably one of my favorites ever so far. PAX was 13 of 135.

...
 
#22 ·
I don't have an "L". What is that? I have N, R, D and P.

Here is a video with some different camera angles. The first is of the extra wide 245/45/16 Hoho tires. Kind of interesting to watch all of the play as they slide around on my skinny rims. The last angle is my serious face while I drive. Seeing this made me realize (again) that I need to look further ahead on the course.

 
#24 ·
↑↑↓↓←→←→BA

Got it!

I will for sure try that... Prolly on the way to work tomorrow. I didn't even know there was an "L" mode. Thanks!
 
#27 ·
The Minis have dominated HS for over 10 years. They are currently faster than GS in the national events, so it really changes nothing for me. I am still gunning for the Minis. Now I just get compete with more people as I do it. Hopefully we can field a full class are regional level events.
 
#28 · (Edited)
A Hyundai Genesis Turbo Coupe 2010-2012 rear drive is in GS. Mighty tough to compete there....

I'd have another second to make up (from about 1.5 to 2.5) in F Street (without considering the R drive Genesis). More mighty tough to compete...probably not even in trophy territory any more...

For me, it would be a real disappointment, and probably for the other HS folks in the MKE AX community. There is a pretty good size group of Front Street HS folks here.
 
#30 ·
Yep. And I added more lead to my foot. A Lot of rules are changing next year for stock, so I am not doing anything till I know whats going on. It doesn't look promising. Camber is first on my list if it will be allowed. Shocks next. Springs are not allowed in stock and wont be under any expected changes.
 
#31 ·
Rainy and cool, so a good day to put together some videos (I guess). These are from the MKE SCCA event 2 on 5/12/13 and WAI event 2 on 5/19/13.

Did pretty well on the 12th finally switching to the "D" setting after trying "L" in the morning. While "L" worked OK at the WAI event on 4/28, it didn't work for me here. I think it is because of hitting the rev limit (about 6200RPM) a little too often. In "D", tach got down to near 3K RPM only twice, so not too bad for lugging. Ended up with a 3rd place, but only about 1/2 (an index) sec out of first in Front Street (so maybe need more like 3/4 second raw).

On the 19th, it was OK. Took a second place in front street (with 62.203 sec), but more like 1.3 seconds out of first. Here I just left things in "D" for all the runs. Don't have tach video of the best run (2), but run 5 was OK and tach got close to 3K RPM once. At that point I was trying your "hands stuck to the wheel" method. For run 4, I also tried a lot of steering input (trying to move the rear end around), but it didn't work well for me. There was a point where the revs ended up below 3K RPM, which is a bad thing (in my opinion).

MKE SCCA Event 2, 5-12-13, run 2 with the CRZ on Vimeo (5/12 run 2 - 64.316 sec)
MKE SCCA Event 2, 5-12-13, run 6 with the CRZ on Vimeo (5/12 run 6 - 62.589sec)
WAI Event 2, 5-19-13, run 4 with the CRZ on Vimeo (5/19 run 4 - 62.982 sec)
WAI Event 2, 5-19-13, run 5 with the CRZ on Vimeo (5/19 run 5 - 62.526 sec)

B
 
#35 ·
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